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TOPIC TITLE: Borderline Personality Disorder
Created On 10/22/06 3:24 PM
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4702125952
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What happened to the Borderline Personality Disorder Site? I'd like to hear from people with experience with this disorder. I've been struggling with this for all my life and discovering this disorder is like the proverbial 'aha' light bulb turning on.

I know this is a lifelong struggle. Please share. Did anyone attend the conference at Mt. Sinai on BPD a few weeks ago? I found it informative and supportive.

Raisy
 
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emunahdoj
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I was diagnosed with borderline personality disorder last month..during my second hospitilization...
 
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emunahdoj
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I know what you mean it's like a lightbulb turning on...finding out about the disorder. I've been struggling with it my whole life but i never knew it was borderline personality disorder...now it makes sense? So how are your experiences?
 
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aquabelle
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there's a gr8 non-fiction book abt a woman who overcame her borderline personality disorder. It's called Get me out of here and is by Rachel Reiland. I highly recommend it.
 
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emunahdoj
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I really need to vent...i have been really mean to my boyfriend, yelling at him for hours, calling him names...then i really hurt him and he cries and says that if i like him so much why do i sometimes act so mean. My therapist told me to try to live with my feelings and not yell or attack him. So i just got back from a date with him...and I was acting really nice, non-clingy, and now i feel terrible...like all my emotions are tied up inside me. I feel so empty. So i thought this would help to vent.
 
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gad
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So do you feel that your therapist's advice worked? (Did you manage to deal with the pent up emotions?)
 
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emunahdoj
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This is what ended up happening...i felt like all my emotions were sitting inside me so i ended up yelling at my sister...I felt really bad afterwards. It worked in terms of not attacking my boyfriend, but I needed to let it out somehow. I don't think at my sister is the best way...
 
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gad
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Would it help if you yelled at us?
 
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emunahdoj
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Haha...yeah i think it would...hehe thanks for the offer. I'm glad i finally joined this...i would look at the forumns daily and decided i would finally join. It's really hard...especially being a baal teshuva. This is way off topic but for Shabbos i have to go to different families houses and stuff..so it's so hard to be motivated to do thinks when i'm depressed or every other emotion there is. So it's nice to see in this forumn how different people deal with issues and are frum and go through chagim and things like that.
 
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HopefulMommy
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Leah, welcome to the forum!

Would it help if you right down all about how you are feeling, instead of venting it at people? Then tear up that paper and throw it out, and the anger is gone.

 
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gad
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Another idea may be to go into a closed room or car or outside and scream there.
 
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mouse
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I don't have BPD and I find screaming in a car and for that matter all the other suggestions useless. (I am depressed and have DID among other things.) I find the "crushed" look on the face of the wrong-doer is a real high, since I know I "won." I even did this to a psychiatrist I got angry at and wasn't satisfied until she got all defensive. I know this isn't the friendliest or most functional way to behave but the reaction I get is such a strong postive reinforcer for me that I find it difficult to stop. I very rarely admit to this, but when it is an anonymous forum it is much easiers.


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All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put Humpty Dumpty together again.
 
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gad
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Do you feel bad for the psychiatrist?
 
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mouse
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No, I really don't feel bad for the psychiatrist. She put me in a very bad position in regards to receiving medication and shabbos observance. I had given her more than a week's notice that I was running low on medication, yet she did nothing till erev shabbos and she knows I'm orthodox and what the ramfications of such are. So, no, I don't feel sorry for her. She deserved to be shredded by me.

I come across as a psychopath, don't I?


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All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put Humpty Dumpty together again.
 
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emunahdoj
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Thanks hopefulmommy!
 
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emunahdoj
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I know what you mean when you like the crushed face of the wrong-doer...
 
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gad
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Originally posted by: munkster
I come across as a psychopath, don't I?


No. A psychopath is, as I understand it, someone who doesn't care about others at all. You have clearly shown caring, both in the way you try to help others in this thread, and also in your efforts for your family etc.

I thing that it is normal for people to get a high when they crush others. But as you allude to in a previous post, is it ideal?

 
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mouse
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It's not ideal when the recipient isn't worthy of being crushed. But when the recipient is worthy of being crushed, I can't think of anything better. It feels sooooooooo goooooooood.


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All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put Humpty Dumpty together again.
 
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gad
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Do you think you could feel good if you criticized in a loving way?
 
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HopefulMommy
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Revenge is a natural desire that people have. You don't have to be a psychopath. Everyone feels this way sometimes. That's why Hashem had to give us a mitzvah in the Torah against taking revenge.

I agree with gad -- you don't come off as a psychopath at all.
 
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emunahdoj
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For the past week i've really been trying to listen to my therapist's advice and try to live with my feelings instead of attacking my boyfriend. Tonight i got so angry though and i yelled at him and i even threw something. I feel like he should be happy that for this past week i was so nice to him and really really trying to not attack him. I know it sounds weird that he should be happy i didn't yell at him...but i really am trying. All my years of therapy, since i was twelve, i never got to this point of realizing that i feel empy and it has nothing to do with an outside person. So i'm really really working on myself. But tonight i yelled at him and he has 3 roomates and i think that they think i'm crazy. They heard me yelling. I'm just so scared that he's gonna leave me. I'm so scared. And then i get scared in general that bad things are going to happen. That people are going to die.
 
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gad
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Quote

Originally posted by: leah85
All my years of therapy, since i was twelve, i never got to this point of realizing that i feel empy and it has nothing to do with an outside person.

What do you mean?
 
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emunahdoj
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I always had a problem with a relationship, or a person i was with, and obsessed over this person. I thought that if only things would go the way i wanted, he would call, he would say the right thing to me, i would be happy. But now i realize it's not about that other person. It's about me. No other person is going to make me happy. I always thought that if only other people acted the way i wanted i would feel better. So now that i don't put my issues on another person, i realize that i myself don't feel good, and i am the only person that can make myself feel better and feel ok.
 
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su7kids
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Leah that is a major realization to come to. I know it took ME a long time to get to that one. The other part of is, too, is that just because someone likes you or not, doesn't make you any different. So many people also want approval from others, but you are the great person you are, regardless of what they think. Its just their opinion.


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Proud Mom of 7, MIL to 3, Grandmom of 4!
 
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gad
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Originally posted by: leah85
And then i get scared in general that bad things are going to happen. That people are going to die.

Because of you? Or just in general?
 
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HopefulMommy
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Leah, some people live their whole lives blaming others for their problems. You have to appreciate yourself for getting this far. Maybe instead of getting upset when you mess up you can give yourself some positive feedback when you succeed.
 
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emunahdoj
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Thank you all for your encouraging words and for giving me credit for getting to this point
 
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4702125952
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Leah,

I struggled and still do with borderline, though I'm doing much, much better, Thank G-d. Do you take meds? Anti-depressants work by "taking the edge off".

All the other stuff--exercise, good nutrition. We have an obligation to to treat others respectfully.

Read, read, read about b.p.d. so you're really knowledgable. Take pride in 'breaking the cycle'. Chances are you were exposed to, or raised by borderline parent(s).
 
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emunahdoj
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Hi,

It's so nice to hear from someone who can relate. I'm taking seroquel and celexa. I have a great family and grew up really well....so i don't understand why i have this...

So what were your experiences with borderline?
 
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4702125952
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Leah,

It's a long story, but in short: I grew up with an abusive borderline mother and a father who was mentally unstable. Being sensitive by nature, I expereinced a great deal of anxiety, physical and emotional abuse, insecurity, chaos, trauma--you name it.

What has helped me: faith in G-d, intelligence (a gift), the ability to feel my feelings and the inability to stifle or deny them, an unending quest for understanding, some kind people along the way.

After I had children my quest became not abusing them the way I had been treated. This required getting a grip on my rage and distrust. I'm still a work in progress, but seeing my children emotionally stable makes it all worthwhile.

How about you?
 
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Debbi
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I'm jumping in here, hoping that its ok.

I too have many borderline tendencies, for which I atrribute directly to my childhood, where I was exposed to sxual molestation, aswell as emotional neglect. Besides for that, I grew up in a well organised home, very little chaos, lots of structure, with all the right toys and clothes. To the undiscerning eye, my family of nine siblings, appeared to be a model of wealthy, hard working, bright, successful, emotionally stable people!
How wrong would the undiscerning eye have been! This couldnt be further from the truth, and it is only now, as we are for the most part grown with families of our own, that we are begining to comprehend the consequences of years of stealthily hidden abuse and neglect.

I agree with you 4702125952, that observing my well adusted beautiful children, is my sweetest revenge to the horrors I suffered.
The good part about BPD is that it really is curable. If you work hard enough, and are lucky enough to have a therapist who is trustworthy and caring, then very many of the symptoms will disappear. I myself can testify to that.

I imagine that there are some things I will always be left with, such as my near complete distrust in people. Although I have good reason to trust my therapist, who has not abandoned me through very difficult times, there will always be that damaged part of me that does not own the ability to feel confident in another.

I have been working for close to 10 years on overcoming the serious side of BPD, which for me includes cutting, and attempting/threatening suicide. And I proudly say that I have had tremendous success in these areas. I still do cut, and there are times when suicide feels like the only option, but these moments have become few and far between, and also I no longer "need" to communicate my emotional distress by bloodletting. I have a mouth, and B'H I am articulate, so that I can verbalise my pain to my therapist or my husaband without resorting to "crazy" behavior.

What I really wanted to convey is my support and empathy to all of you who suffer from this disorder, and also to tell you that with lots of hard work, this disorder can be cured.

Good luck!
debbi
 
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emunahdoj
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4702125952...

Thank you so much for sharing your experiences. I think it's so great that after you had children your quest was to not abuse them the way you were treated. It's also great that you realized you had to get a grip on your rage and distrust. That's something that is very difficult for me. It must be so rewarding to se your children that are emotionally stable. It is so nice and comforting to hear that you can lead a productive life and raise emotionally stable kids.

B'H i grew up in a loving, stable home, but I become very angry, have huge trouble with trusting, think people are thinking things about me and have difernt motives, and have really big fear of abandonment. I worry that I won't be able to have a family and that I'll be abusive to my kids or yell at my husband and be suspisous.

 
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emunahdoj
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Debbi,

I'm so glad you joined in on the conversation! It's so eye opening to hear that on the outside your family appeared to be all together, but really there was a lot of hiddedn abuse and neglect going on.

It's so great that you have well adjusted children and it must feel so nice to have that.

It is SO comforting to hear that BPD is really curable. It feels like a daily struggle of terrible emotions and that my mind is going crazy. It's so nice to hear you say that many of the symptoms will disappear. It's really great that you have a thearpist that you are close with.

Many nights I feel suicidal, and I am always worrying, scared people will leave me, feel depresed, my mood changes so fast I don't even know how I feel. To think that I will have a family, a husband, kids, scares me. How can I have such a commitment and responsibility when I can't even trust my own mind? It's nice to hear that your moments have become fewer. I get so so angry and yell at my boyfriend for hours, I become so mean it's like a differnt person.

To hear that you are married and have kids and are doing better really gives me hope. It just still so often feels that i have a lifetime of worry, fear, anxiety, worry, worry, worry.


 
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emunahdoj
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I really need help...and i really need to write this. I just went to a shiur with the guy I am dating, and on the way back to my house my boyfriend said a minor thing that looking back was not a big deal, and i yelled a lot at him. We were in front of my house in the car, and my parents who were in the house heard me yelling. At that moment it feels so terrible, "like a tornado" as my therapist says.
Then later i regret it. My boyfriend says he just wants to feel comfortanble in our relationship. He says that he always feels he is on edge and that he's scared to say anything cuz one little thing can upset me.
He's such an amazing guy but i keep yelling at him. I don't want to lose him. I drill him about his past, even though i myself have a strong past. I demand things of him. He said when i do this it makes him scared. He says the way i say things are very scary.
HELP!! What do i do? I can't control myself when i'm in that moment.
 
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gad
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When you feel yourself getting upset, you can remind yourself of how terrible you feel after you yell. Perhaps remembering that feeling may help you to be calm.
 
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mouse
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I'm not sure if this was mentioned in a previous post (it is something I read somewhere.) Pay attention to the physical symptoms right before one of these outbreaks. Do your hands sweat? Do you tense muscles? etc. That is when it may be goood to have a time out and run for it. I don't have borderline personality, however, I have similar issues at time with my anger. When my mind starts to race, my neck feel sore, my hands get sweaty, my eyes feel droopy that is when I know I need a time out and I tell people that I need it and if I don't get it, there will be problems. Even with my own kids I say, "You did nothing wrong, but mommy needs a time out and she needs it now." They know to gve me space for a few minutes and once the anger has gone most of the way, I resume daily activities. I hope this helps. (It takes a while to figure out how you feel right before an episode. You may need to write it down.)

For what it's worth, I think it is great you know and admit you have borderline personality disorder. My family strongly suspects my mom does, but since she sees having a mental issue as a personal weakness, she has not and will not seek help. She makes us all miserable. As a child witha mom who has a major personality issue (undiagnosed), I suggest you get the anger thing under control before marriage (which is what it sounds like you are doing.) It made me and my siblings miserable and nutty and we all have a stress-related illness as a result of growing up with such a "stable" mom.


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All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put Humpty Dumpty together again.
 
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emunahdoj
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This is awful. I think i am a hopeless case. My boyfriend called me on his lunch break today at work and told me he is going on a trip about 6 hours away where he is from with his roomates for 4 days. I got very upset, and he said he had to go. I called him about 16 times at work until he picked up. I said it's rude that he's leaving me. He said "i like you and i want to spend my life with you but when you turn into a different person and yel at me and control me it makes me have doubts of spending my life with you." That's so rude! Then he said "i'm not sure if you're my soulmate i just want to be sure." It's just a huge mess. He said i'ts emotionally draining the way i interagate him on the phone for hours. But i can't help it. When i'm in that moment NOTHING will help
 
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gad
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Sorry things are tough for you now. Hope you soon have happy news to report. Have a good Shabbos.
 
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emunahdoj
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Does anyone who has BBP or is dealing with or has dealt with BDP have a suggestion? My anger and emotions are so out of control that I am seriously abusing my boyfriend. He is so confused about how i can be the sweetest person one second and a totaly different person the next second, how I can be so mean and harsh to him when I say I care about him. I feel like if i just say "type in borderline personality disorder" under google, he will read about it and say "whoa, this is so her." I feel like he would understand me better and realize why i am the way i am. But at the same time, I don't want him to know i have BPD. He knows I have depression and he knows I am on medicaion. But BPD sounds terrible...i feel like he would be scared to spend his life with someone like this (he said he's scared.)
 
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frumsw
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Ever try a DBT group?


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frumsw
 
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asiwalkinthestreets
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I am in a DBT group. I find it helps. My struggle is to alow my bad emotions to surface.
Often I live in a silent world. Not being able to talk, utter, express...
Ui vavui, tzoruis tzrieruis.


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mbd's song, as I walk in the street I see so many lonely pl.
 
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gad
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How do you allow your bad emotions to surface in a healthy way?
 
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4702125952
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I think venting about the emotions to a therapist or good friend--who knows about Borderline is very helpful.

Doesn't knowing that you have borderline tendancies give you at least some objectivity so you know when you are behaving borderline and GET OUT/AWAY from the situation in which you are raging/abusing.

I think a lot of introspection is due, and perhaps grieving, for the terrible insecurity one must have suffered that brings to BPD. I believe it is a failure of what Erik Errikson called the psychosocial stage from birth - 2 where security in the world and mankind develops.

You can be helped. You must decide that you will not hurt others because you have been hurt.

Let go of your anger. Internalize that distrust is a middah you will have to opt out of. We must conciously choose to trust.
 
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emunahdoj
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Besides the abandonment i fear, having BPD...i have teribble bad feelings...do any of you have those awful bad feelings? Terrible fear?
 
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nutcase
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Hi. I have BPD as well... I have never been officially diagnosed however, all symptoms of BPD, describe me precisely.

I have a wonderful dbt therapist who I see every week and I join her weekly group session as well. I was seeing her for 6 months however I didn't feel any change-recently she suggested that I go on medication. Dr. Grossman put me on lamictol-a mood stabilizer. I am on it for two weeks and I see a major change! For the fist time in my life my head is clear and I have a choice on how to react...

I am not telling anyone on what medication they should go on, but there is hope! I was so down in the dumps and so utterly alone! I am finally seeing a glimmer through the cracks of the tunnel. I have yet to see the entire light, but the glimmer is lighting the path to success!

Everyone out there struggling-- please continue having faith. If you believe in yourself-everything is possible! Don't let setbacks destroy you... keep on working and slowly but surely you'll reap the fruits of your labor.

Good luck guys...
 
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rainbow
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The more I read about it, The more convinced I am that I have BPD.

My therapist specialises in DBT. But all I am getting from the weekly sessions is more and more feelings of guilt. I come home from therapy worse than I was before. I have tried a DBT group, but it was so cold and impersonal, that I quit, and just read the book at home. I understand the whole concept of DBT, but I still have to learn how to use it to benefit MY life.

There are many books out for people who live with BPD people, but very little about what the BPD person is suffering. A support group would be great, but since this is kept as a secret, it is not possible for me to join a group.

Sadly, the ones that suffer the most are my husband and kids.

Only those who have been there can understand the pain of feeling so empty and scared that you become depressed, I can barely function on a daily basis, I feel like life has no point. B"H I am not suicidal nor do I injure myself or the people around me. It just affects me emotionally.

I am under a very good Dr.s care, and take meds, but I am starting to lose hope.
 
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HopefulMommy
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I don't know anything about either BPD or DBT, but I have a general comment. I find that with any challenge, and especially with mental health, there are two types of responses. It's either feeling sorry for the person, "you poor baby, it's not your fault, let me give you this medicine and you'll be alright." Or ignoring the person's feelings completely and pushing them to overcome the challenge, "you are making yourself mentally ill; if you only do this and think that, you'll be just fine." I don't find either response appropriate. There are two sides to it. In any difficult situation, a person needs both the acknowledgement of their pain and unconditional acceptance of their feelings, and at the same time, encouragement to work on the issue and belief that the person has the capability to meet the challenge.

Rainbow, I think you are getting the latter from your therapist, but not the former. Mental health challenges are extremely difficult. If Hashem is giving you this challenge, this means He believes in you and your ability to overcome it. But knowing that doesn't make it any easier. It doesn't make it any less painful. You have to acknowledge that pain. You have to give yourself permission to cry and grieve over being put in such a situation. You need support and unconditional love. And at the same time, you have to work hard and move forward. But you need both. It doesn't help to have one without the other, in my experience.
 
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emunahdoj
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11/5/08 2:58 AM
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Rainbow...i feel your pain. I really believe no one knows how it feels to feel so empty and scared unless you have been there.
I yelled at the guy I am dating...again...and he told me he is not proposing because I keep yelling at him and it needs to get to the point where I don't act that way. I am the one who is not allowing marriage to happen...it feels so awful.
 
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rainbow
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11/10/08 12:22 AM
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I just finished reading the book -get me out of here- by Rachel Reiland. She writes about her struggle with BPD, and how she finally got better. I found it very comforting to read. You feel you can relate to the author.
Read it only when you are in a good mood, not when you are down and feel like giving up.
 
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justso
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11/12/08 2:05 AM
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I recently started a DBT group. I also go to Recovery Inc. mtgs. Recovery-inc.org
They augment each other well . Recovery is a self help group , if you go to the website, it will do a better job of explaining what it is.

DBT teaches us to tolerate distress and manage our emotions rather than explode or shut down. I love the class. I am so grateful that HaKodesh Barechu helped me find and get into the group. But it does require committment and there's homework (which I am avoiding/procrasinating right now as I write The exercises are simple but NOT EASY, but the pay off is big!

Have hope. And as they say in REcovery "helplessness is not hopelessness," and "there are no hopeless cases."

persist and be patient with yourself and others
 
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