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Created On 6/28/13 4:13 PM
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channafofanna
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Ok, so here are my questions:
Cutting. Why arent we alowed to cut? The torah says lo tisgodidu becuase its the way of the goyim to do that when someone dies. So why cant we cut when no one dies? becuase its not like the goyim if its just stam. Also, a person is allowed to undergo surgery, why? because even though it hurts them and is dangerous, it will make them feel better, so its ok. so why wouldnt one be allowed to cut for that same exact reason? it hursts and MAY be dangerous but will make them feel better. If its non- fatal wounds then I dont see the harm in it. And why dont the goyim like cutting if its non-fatal? It heals so whats the big deal?

Next- purging. Dosent the shulchan aruch say one is alowed to purge if it will make them feel better? So why cant we. If the torah lets whats the problem.

Next question- I am CONSTANTLY pulling out my hair, especialy when i read, daven or am in bed. So If im davening and I pull out a hair, do I have to go wash before I continue? Ill just end up going back to wash 30 seconds later!!! And should I concentrate more on the davening or on the not pulling? wich one is more important? if i pull in bed, do I have to go wash? becuase if i do then ill never sleep becuase ill be walking to wash everytime i lay back into bed!!! And if i have to wash, my family will think im a nut, running to wash every three seconds. I dont need to be called OCD (even though hair pulling is ocd, but whatever)

Also, i hear that if you pull one less hair then you would like its considered that your not mechalel shabbos. So if on friday night I try like a a maniac and dont pull for some odd reason( aka, tonz of hashgacha) then can i pull as much as i want on shabbos day and still be considered keeping shabos?


Sorry for all of the questions!!! you dont have to answer if you dont want or dont know or whatever...
thanks!
 
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Dr. Price MD
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Excellent questions. You would have to ask a posek. Please let me know the answers.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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star
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Dr .Price, do you believe in Hell?
Either i can feel ,when i watch tv on shabbos, that He understands its from pain and wont punish me, or i think
but what about when its speaks of gehinnom- how do i know i wont get punished and then suffer in both worlds?


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Dr. Price MD
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No hell in Judaism. Gehenom to purify the soul if necessary.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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star
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thanks. so no burning?no pain,spiritual or physical?(where do rabbis get the burning idea from then?)


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Dr. Price MD
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A mashal like burning off the trayf when kashering an oven.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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star
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what? the oven would hurt if it were a person. so it will hurt?


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channafofanna
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but Dr. Price, I dont have a posek to ask, thats why im asking you!!!! Its not really going to change anything lmaasah, so can you just answer theoreticaly? its not going to change anything i do... whats the worst that can happen? youre wrong? please answer for me!! I have nobody else to ask!!!
 
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Dr. Price MD
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As a general principal the Torah asks that we safeguard our health. Since there are other, more healthy ways of treating an Eating Disorder other than vomiting or coping with BPD other than cutting, these coping mechanisms may be discouraged. I do not know if these disorder apply here or not but I am just speaking in general terms. Induced vomiting may be necessary for one's health in case of ingesting a harmful substance. Cutting through surgery may be necessary for one's health in case of a malignant tumor which must be removed to prevent metastasis. I hope this clarifes a little.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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channafofanna
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ok, thanks.. it clarefies a bit... i appreciate it... what about my hair pulling questions?
thank you
 
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Dr. Price MD
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Best to focus on the activity (davening) rather than on not pulling. You could probably get a heter on the washing thereafter as part of a therapy intended to break the vicous pull-wash cycle.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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channafofanna
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ok, thank you so much!!
 
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so will gehinnom hurt?


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Dr. Price MD
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In a "spiritual" way, whatever that means.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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channafofanna
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What do you do if you dont like one of your clients or patients? Have any of your patients ever comited suicide? Does that upset the psychiatrist or its just another day on the job?
 
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star
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so who knows maybe spiritual pain will be worse then physical pain? so how can i not be scared?


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Dr. Price MD
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If you do not like your client, you should refer to a new therapist. No one committed suicide while still under my care, Baruch HaShem. Definitely NOT just another day on the job.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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Dr. Price MD
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No one came back yet to relate the details.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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star
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so just dont think about gehonim?or maybe try to be perfect like the people who talk about schar all the time? maybe they are right?


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channafofanna
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IMHO- just cuz someone talks about schar all the time dosent mean theyre perfect. proof- me!! i talk the talk but i pull out my hair on shabos and skip mincha and most of shachris, and do lotsa bad stuff!!!
 
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star
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dont think u can get worse then me- i watch tv on shabbos! although i got a heter but he said to use a fork to push the buttons but i only use my left hand and he said when choli-i guess sick- and i never know how depressed i have to be...


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channafofanna
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I wasnt trying to prove im a bad jew, i was just saying those "perfect people " who talk about schar all day arent so perfect... or at least im not....
 
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star
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ok i get you. i had someone ask me to be mochel her so she wouldnt suffer after 120 years! how noble!lol


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ShtarkeMentch
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Maybe she asked you to be mochel so that she wouldn't suffer now and for the next 120 years
Carrying around the guilt of a ruined relationship can be more painful than any physical pain. As most of us know only too well from personal experience.
This is true whether it is our fault or theirs, or as is usually the case, a little bit of both mixed up with the pain and distortion that our diseases add to the mix to fuel the fires.
Often times asking for mechilah (while extremely difficult) can be the way for us to get out of the Gehenom that we are in right now.
 
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channafofanna
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Sorry Dr. Price for all these random questions. You dont have to answer.
What do you think about sensa or weight loss pills/powders etc? Are they good? Bad? Will they interact with meds (prozac and welbutrin)
Thansk!!
 
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Dr. Price MD
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Some are okay like Sensa, Alli, Hoodia. Others are not like ephedra, yerma mate. Depends on the medication. Let me know how you make out.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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channafofanna
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so you would let one of your patients take one of them?
 
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Dr. Price MD
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The former group are safe.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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channafofanna
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ok, thanks so much!!! I know this is probably something stupid cuz its probably not for people with ED, but I cant take it anymore... I just hope it works. It says you can loose like 30 pounds. If I loose about thirty five pounds then im done! thats all i need. I just need to be underweight. then ill be happy and fine. ill feel good about myself and have friends and things will be ok. I really hope it works though....
Thanks again!!!
 
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channafofanna
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Will they work?
 
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Dr. Price MD
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Can try. Alli requires a multivitamin to replenish Vitamins A,D,E,K which can be lost. Let me know how you make out.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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channafofanna
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ok. thanks
 
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I'mTrying
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Quote

Originally posted by: channafofanna
If I loose about thirty five pounds then im done! thats all i need. I just need to be underweight. then ill be happy and fine. ill feel good about myself and have friends and things will be ok. I really hope it works though....
Thanks again!!!


I really hope you can find happiness Channa...
I'm noticing that what you wrote is exactly what I, and every other person whom I know suffers from ED, says. Unfortunately, I have found it to be a lie and an illusion. Having friends and feeling good about yourself and being happy and fine and everything is hunky dory... That CAN happen. But not because you lost 35 lbs. and are now underweight. That will not bring happiness. I am 100% sure about that. Eating disorders are sly and insidious. They lure you with promises of amazing things. But then you get into the cave with them and you find yourself falling into a deep black endless pit.
I care about you so much Channa. If I can help you find a way to happiness and friends and 'alle gutte zachen" without resorting to making yourself sicker, I will gladly support you and encourage you and try as best as I can to show you that we care!
wish
 
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channafofanna
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Thanks, it means a lot to me.
I know all that stuff but it WILL be true with me!! If I loose 35 lbs i will Iy"H be the PERFECT WEIGHT!! and I wont worry so much about my appearence and therefore I will be able to be self confident and be the real me and get friends. I know you think once I loose 35 (if I actualy do) then I will say "just five more" but i wont. I know that it is physicaly imposible for me to loose more than about 35 pounds so i know for a fact that if i loose that weight i will be done. Plus, I know im not fat (B"H, bli ayin hora) I know im average weight, so i cant really have an ED right now cuz i dont look in the miror and see obeese, i just see me, with just 35lbs extra. This sounds so rediculous, but it isnt. It is REALY TRUE FOR ME!!! I ONLY need 35!!! Once I loose 35 i will just work on maintaining my weight. And I am eating, not purging or using laxitives, and maybe even using sensa. I am loosing wiehgt in a healthy way, and there is nothing wrong with that!!! Its good! But thanks for your concern and offer!!
 
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wishtobehappy
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That is so true wish.

Channa, in case it didn't register before, you sound like such a special, amazing, and good-hearted person. We all care about you. It would be a real pity for you to waste your effort and energy on something that is self-destructive.
 
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channafofanna
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thanks, but I think this is something that i need to do for myself. exersizing helps me feel alive and alliveite my depression and restricting is the only thing that makes me feel good and have energy and feel alive (ironic, no?) and its not like im restricting majorly. im just trying to eat a bit less... and it never works anyway so you dont have to worry....
but thanks guys!!!
 
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wishtobehappy
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Doing something for yourself sure sounds like progress. I won't dare to interfere in that case. Savor every minute of the high. You can even dance to the beat of the rumbling in your stomach
 
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channafofanna
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thanks=)
 
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channafofanna
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Why does suicide sound so alluring? why do we all want to do it so much? what about a chemical imbalance makes us want to die?
 
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channafofanna
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also why wont meds help? Anxiety ones to stop it from always being on our minds and depression ones for making us able to deal with life? If im on doses higher than the FDA recomends as highest possible dose yet still have severe depression on the Beck Depression Scale, then dosent that prove that mental illness isnt biological? Is the meds for a placebo affect so that we can work on therapy and think the meds are making us get better faster. It dosent make sence that chemicals make us feel. but if its not chemical than all the mental illness info is made up because if we can get better by talk therapy then we are normal people who are just weaker than everyone elso so we dont cope with normal everyday things?
 
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Dr. Price MD
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Tell me what you think of this. The soul yearns to leave this material world and reunite with its source in Gan Eden. The higher the level the soul, the more pain in this world and greater the pleasure in the next. This helps me explain the suicidal instinct in good people who do not fit in here and fail to respond to chemical treatments.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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HopefulMommy
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Wow! I've always felt this way, but I thought I was just crazy . It's good to hear this from a professional!
 
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keep climbing
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Wow, Hopeful.. I second that!
Can it really be ?
 
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keep climbing
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My rebbe says that when you are feeling low you should feed the Guf.(good food, aromatic flowers, music, nature, exc.) I would guess that this grounds the Guf.

Also, I read this this morning on aish.com:

"A sense of dignity is very important for most human beings. When we embarrass another person, it is as if we robbed that person of his/her humanity. For the moment, the person wishes he doesn't exist."
Draw your own conclusions.....
 
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channafofanna
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I hear that, but what if somebody is a bad person and does horrible things? What if you kill yourself? then you wont have that pleasure!! And if that is the case wouldnt suicide be a GOOD choice becuase then your neshama will be in shamayim? what if things are good and your ok and your making up the pain? then there is no pain so im just suicidal cuz im selfish and lazy, so then theres no gan eden in my futrue so how can i accept such an answer for myself. maybe it aplys to others but not me...
uch!! i wish suicide wasnt the best possible option!!! why cant I just stop thinking about it?!?!? how can I live if all i want to do is die? why cant i be killed instead of all those inocent victims who get killed who WANT to live. Why cant G-d give me what I want? I want two things and two things only- for me to die and for everyone around be not to be sad about it or get depressed or any ideas. Two things! But i guess thats to much...
 
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Dr. Price MD
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The soul is not ours to take. Only HaShem can take it back when He allows. If we take that decision into our own hands, we lose Gan Eden. But the propensity to want to be reunited with our Source so not so "crazy." Value judgments such as "good" and "bad" are often the the satan's work, trying to sabotage our present and future. Unconditional positive self regard and acceptance can be the best way to self improvement and living in this world.

Rabbi Price, M.D.
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wishtobehappy
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This theory is such a solace. What a relief. Thanks, Dr. Price.

Keep climbing, what your Rebbe said about grounding the Guf with earthly pleasures is really interesting. Thanks for sharing.
 
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wishtobehappy
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Hopeful, I'm in the same crazy boat with you and trying hard not to sink it
 
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HopefulMommy
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Well, being on frumsupport makes me feel less crazy!
 
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channafofanna
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so if i start loving myself ill stop being so crazy suicidal all the time? is there any way thats easier and less painful than that?
also, its not the satans work making you feel bad if you do bad things( like the 3 three things u should rather die then do) I have atempted murder (on myself) and embaressed many people.i have been untznius or to provocative (that is considered arayos acording to some) and have been off the derech and worshiped (food or lack of it). I have absolutley no intention on doing tshuva on anything other than embaressing people.... that is BAD, no way around it!!! and if the desire to die shows a G-dly neshama, then why is suicide such a bad sin cuz its steming from a desire of getting close to Hashem?
thanks, sorry for all theese questions! Thank you for your patience! im just so full of questions once I ask one its like the dam breaks and i need to asak a few more. you dont have to answer them. There not psychiatrist questions so it wouldnt even be wrong acording to your resoponsbilites to the site....
 
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